I see many groups, even local ones, whose drummer plays to a click track. In my experience -- PROS: Eliminates starting a song too fast or too slow. Helps to eliminate the tendency to speed up songs due to adrenaline rush, either by the drummer or the rest of the band. Keeps the drummer from slowing down. CONS: Makes the drummer so aware of tempo that creativity dies. Drumming sounds mechanical. Rest of the band doesn't listen to the drummer and sets its own tempo, which the drummer tries unsucessfully to match, creating rhythmic chaos (if chaos can be rhythmic).

If your band does this, what is your opinion? Do you find that it helps or hinders performances? How do you arrive at the correct tempo for the song?

I have been in bands before where they insist upon using a click track. I've noticed that even though these guys rocked hard, there wasn't any flow..or soul to what they played. All the way down the line it sounded mechanical and forced. Personally, I feel that drummers that play to a click track (live especially) are not confident in their abilities to find the time and hold it. I grew up playing to a metronome, but when I am behind the kit onstage, I know my time signature changes and tempo changes no matter which song we walk into. It's a confidence thing as well as being musically comfortable with the people your playing with. Those drummers that play with click tracks live develop an unhealthy dependency on that audible click.

Thanks, drumguy -- nice to hear from someone behind the skins. I've played with drummers who were rock solid and drummers who sped up and dragged (but never both in one drummer). None of them used a click. I think a metronome can be used by a drummer to set the tempo initially, but I also think the band should be able to feel each other out enough to adjust as required. I know that a few drummers I've played with, when forced to play to a click, cut back on fills and go with kick-snare most of the time. Some of them even gave up on using crash cymbals. Rather boring, IMHO.

I personally use a small in ear metronome that I can set to get my initial tempo and then forget. But again I believe it comes down to comfort. Seems like no one wants to play the music anymore...always concerned about rips and tears through the group. Now granted these are problems...but sometimes it's best to relax and play the music..not play to it.

Part of the joy, for me, of listening to albums recorded in the '60s and '70s is that they were made on tape recorders and drummers didn't use a click. There's a slight ebb and flow to a live band that doesn't use a click that is hard to explain but is there nonetheless. I think the fact that some recording software that includes a click can be made to vary the beat to give the track a more live feel.

Much like drumguydave, I keep a Tama Rhythm Watch in line and pull it in to reference at the beginning of songs and sometimes around the bridge if I feel like we're rushing. Great when used as a reference but definitely hurts creativity and the naturally feel of music if used throughout. Although, venues do love it when you can give them a very scheduled performance and referencing the click during songs can keep you on time for an hour set down to the minute if the rest of the band is on top of it.

I also agree with Laklander when he said that drummers tend to pull back to basics and skip fills or any tom/cymbal work in the turn around. I know when I first began using a click, all I heard was kick and snare, and if i threw in 1/8 notes, then maybe hihat - but when it came to fills I was lost. Now I really enjoy practicing with a click because sometimes during fills it helps me create syncopation and gives me idea's for new grooves.

Either way, it's definitely a drummer to drummer case where they are all different. One thing I think we can all agree on is that your drummer should definitely be able to play with a click whether he chooses to or not - when it comes to time to record this can save your engineer so much time and you so much money in editing and tracking.

I still favor going with the flow live as long as you have drummer who is reliable with tempo. For practice, you should be able to find a groove, then figure out what the setting is, not the other way around. I can't tell you how many times our singer, who is a stickler for using the click, tries a song at, say, 82 BPM, then says -- "No it should be 83." He either has a quartz crystal for a brain or I am seriously time-sensitivity deficient. But I have tapes of my '70s band doing a Yes tune so fast that I am amazed we could pay it at all. And Toyota thinks they have runaway acceleration problems.

Hahah, you can never play a Yes tune too fast!

In regards to the groove, I was referencing when I practice alone on the drums - not with the band. The Tama Rhythm Watch lets you mix in triplets or 1/8ths and so on. So when I practice my rudiments and beats ect., it can bring new light and ideas to certain beats for me.

But I agree, I would never use a click track to find a groove - I don't even think you could call it a groove then!

I feel that all new bands, no matter how tight your drummer is should play to a click track. I think it should be an on and off thing. I think it is good to play without a click track and learn to feel each other, but I feel that once you find your grove, set the tempo and turn on the click. Nothing bothers me more than seeing a band run away with tempos. I think a lot of young musicians tend to blame the drummer too much for inconsistent tempos though. Every one in the band is truly part of the rhythm section at some point. The click track isn't just for the drummer, its for the tightness of the group. Many pros use them. Even the best drummers. Like RINGO STARR! Best. Drummer. Ever.

Agreed - being a relatively new drummer, it makes me feel more comfortable that I am fulfilling my duties as the drummer well and makes the band solid tight. Especially when I send the click to the bassist!

Unfortunately, you can't rely on your rig to always work perfectly (last night) and have to be able to pull on through and feel confident without the click as well. IT really is a perfect mix - but should never be a crutch you can walk without.

Hey guys,

I'm the drummer in PushKodi (pushkodi.com) we are a UK based rock/electro/dance act. Our tracks are based around a lot of synths and sample effects, with guitar, bass and vocals played live. Depending on the track we start off with guitar, bass and drums then lay samples down over the top with Cubase. We pan a click to the right. I use a Roland SPDS, with a small 10 channel powered mixer, this allows me to control my click track volume. I have an in ear monitor in my right ear, and hear the rest of the band in my left. I normally have a stage monitor nearby also. For larger stages we would use a wireless setup with click, backtrack (SPDS) and general monitor mix, in ear. I have been using this setup for around 3 years and it has opened so many doors for the band, I don't feel that our sound is clinical and we are always complimented on our tightness. Having a drummer that plays to a click is a very good idea, even for bands that don't play to a backtrack of synths I would definitely recommend using a click. It makes the whole show tighter. As a drummer you only use the click for reference you dont listen to it throughout the track, so you still have freedom to be as creative as you would without with the advantage of being in time!!

Peace! Dx

Welcome to MGR, PushKoDi! It sounds like you've arrived at the ideal situation regarding clicktracks. I can see how having a click in your situation would be a good idea. And I admire the guts you show in laying down loops live.

Personally, I prefer to rely on the drummer to "interpret" the click and keep it out of my mix. If I trust the drummer -- and I do in most cases -- that works best for me. As I stated before, I think there's a danger in becoming too reliant of a click, or trying to keep a song to a certain BPM in live situations, though. Many tomes in the band I play with, the lead singer will ask the drummer to go from, say, 90 BPM to 91 BPM. That seems bit too fine for me.

It sounds like you have some great experience. If you have time, pop over to the MGR review section and post some gear reviews. We love to have hands-on reviews of equipment from working musicians, and there's always the chance you can win a gift card by posting a review.

Nice website: If you get some soundclips up, let us know and post the URLS here.

Hey Laklander

Check out http://www.myspace.com/pushkodi for some tracks. There is a youtube vid of us at Manchester Academy also here http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=S1XFxUtjngs

We used to be called LazyTwo btw! Would be good to know what you think!

D

Very nice! Always good to hear new music, especially when it's good and doesn't sound like everything else out there. I especially like England's Grey Unpleasant Land and I hope You See Me. Have you investigating putting your stuff on iTunes? You'd be surprised what tht can do for you. A friend posted his band, Annasay, on iTunes and one of the US TV networks used a clip for an episode of a TV show. Facebook is a good option, too. Nice video! Best of luck!

I started to perform live with a click track about 3 years ago when samples were incorporated on my band's music. I do think the click can make you sound a little mechanic at first but it's all about practicing. Eventually the click just becomes a "percussive" time-keep element which you can always rely on while you are free to improvise on top of it.